 Posted 03/02/2012 14:33:25
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Hi everyone, I have not been on the forum for a while, so hello to you all again. As I have not been very successful taking most of the medication for OP so I decided to try Boron supplements 3mg 1 a day with Magnesium, Calcium, Vit D and K.1 and 2 and a Collegen supplement ( along with piles of Kale!!) Up to now I have had no unpleasant side effects, so I hope it is working on my bones!! I have read some good reports on Boron. Apparently it can also help with other functions of the body too. I was wondering if anyone else on the forum is using Boron, if so I would be interested in their opinion. I realise no one can tell if it Boron works until the next Dexa Scan, but thought it an interesting mineral with no horrible side effects. Look forward to hearing from you. Hope you are all having a happy day Rosiejay
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Posted 04/02/2012 13:51:44
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Please tell me more about Boron and why it should be added to our programme of supplements.
Thanks
Sarah
Tscore Lumbar spine -3.3, Femoral neck -2.6, Hip -2.2
Alkali diet (+ no caffeine/sugar/salt/rhubarb/spinach) and exercise and supplements of Vit D (2,000IUs daily), Vit K2 as MK7, vit K2 Menatetrenone, Cod liver oil.
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Posted 04/02/2012 14:18:10
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Hi Sarah
This is what Marilyn Glenville says about boron on her website:
"Boron is another mineral that is being widely studied in relation to osteoporosis. Research conducted by the US Department of Agriculture demonstrated that giving post-menopausal women a short course of 3mg boron supplements daily resulted in a 44 percent reduction in the amount of calcium excreted in their urine. The conclusions of this study were that boron improved the metabolism (the way it is used by the body) of both calcium and magnesium. Boron is found in alfalfa, kelp, cabbage and leafy greens."
There's 2mg boron included in the calcium complex supplements I'm taking, along with magnesium, zinc, and vitamins D3 and K2. I seem to be able to tolerate this formula and haven't had any problems taking them, but it's impossible to know whether any of the individual ingredients will do any good!
Jes
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Posted 04/02/2012 17:46:12
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| Hi Sarah, I first saw a supplement on the Internet called Osteotrace Bone Food it looked a good supplement that included Boron. As I was already taking most of the other vitamins in it I just ordered, a good source capsule, of 3mg Boron and thought I would try it. Boron, which is a mineral, increases bone hardness and also helps convert Vit D into Vit D3 the form the body uses to absorb calcium from food to prevent loss of bone density & OP. Apparently, it also helps the Colon, heart Disease. M.S. and High Blood Pressure and it works well with Calcium and Magnesium. Osteotrace Bone Food was created by a Dr. Rex Newnham he has written papers on it. I think there is still a need for more clinical trials on Boron but I am trying it because I would rather try the alternative way than the Orthodox meds and the side effects. I feel fine on it, with no side effects so far, but as I said I will not know if there is any change until my next Dexa Scan. Hope this helps you but I would be interested if you come up with anything else on it.
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Posted 05/02/2012 13:09:24
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| Hi, after reading Lara Pizorno's book I added Boron to my supplements. I now take: Vit d3, K2 mk4 & mk7, Boron 3mg, Magnesium and 500 mg Calcium Citrate, just to supplement what I get from food and Strontium Ranelate. A bit confused about Magnesium though, I've read it should be taken with Calcium and not with Calcium! Any advice? Lulu
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Posted 05/02/2012 14:47:39
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| Hi Lulu, I agree, it all gets very confusing! I think it is best to just try supplements to find out what works for you, as we are all different. However, on saying that there is a very good source supplement, one tablet, which is called Cal/Mag which explains they benefit from each other and are easier on the stomach if taken together with the specific doses listed. Vit K, I believe, guides the Calcium to where it is needed. I have most of the supplements you take except SR and MK 7. I assume MK 7 is Vit K but what are the benefits of taking it? In the Osteotrace supplement, I mentioned above, the Cal/Mag are taken together. I do know for sure, that you don't take SR with Calcium. I wish there was help from the NOS regarding all the supplements that would provide help with the bones it would make our lives much easier and less confusing. Marylyn Glenville is a good website but even then if you read another one it can give you a different view on OP. meds and supplements. No wonder we are confused!! Anyway, I hope I have helped a bit. Keep in touch, wish you the best of luck!
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Posted 05/02/2012 15:35:04
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| Hi Rosiejay, haven't posted on the forums since the summer but read everyday! Mk 7 is vit K, was taking Mk 7 before I read that maybe Mk 4 is better for bones, so I might as well finish the bottle lol! You can get Calcium with Magnesium so maybe they should be taken together for maximum benefit, I only take 1 Magnesium tablet a day as I use a Magnesium body spray which I'm hoping is as good! No side effects from SR and am on my 14th month of taking it. we have very similar DEXA scores -3 for lumbar spine and -2 for neck of femur, will be interesting to see what the next scans are like. Lulu
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Posted 05/02/2012 19:35:09
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| Hi Rosejay and Lulu I agree that supplements can be very confusing. Vit K2 is fat soluble and should be taken with fatty food. The two forms we are interested in are MK-7 and MK-4.The Mk-7 is taken to help to prevent the calcium be deposited in the arteries. The Dr Mercola's web site has lots of information about K2 I buy Dr's Best and take 2 per day at separate times, depending on when I eat food containing fat. Vit K2 MK-4 is the standard OP treatment in Japan. Although it may help with keeping the calcium out of the arteries, in Japan it is used at a high dose of 45mg per day, because it helps with the actual bone development and repair. The problem with it is: it has a short half life of about 2 hrs, so I would assume that it is taken in smaller quantities, every few hrs throughout the day, to gve a total of 45mg per day. It is expensive to buy sufficient tablets to take at this dosage. I buy 5mg tablets from iHerb and take 2 per day, but I think I may be wasting my money if each tablet is only active for a few hrs. I would need to take 9 per day to match the Japanese dosage. I already take Strontium Ranelate, so I think it would be over-kill to take the M-4 at a high dose, apart from the cost. Many of us believe that it is better to buy separate, rather than multi vit supplements. Although calcium can be taken with magnesium, it is harder to control the amounts (ratio) of Ca : Mg, if they are in a combined tablet. It is said that the ratio of Ca:Mg should be approximately 2:1. If you take a lot of dairy products the ratio is way out. 100ml of Skimmed Milk contains 120mg of Ca, but only 11mg of Mg. You therefore would need to take additional Magnesium which would have to be in a separate tablet. I buy Holland and Barrett chelated easy absorb (glycinated) Mg which comes in 150mg tablets, which doesn't upset my stomach. Many of the combined tablets would contain Mg oxide, which is harder to absorb and may upset your stomach. Calcium (and vit D3) should be taken with food. Magnesium is very alkaline and can alter the pH of your stomach contents, which in turn can alter the digestion and absorption of some of the nutrients contained in the meal. This why its better to take Mg 30 mins after a meal. Another point about calcium, you shouldn't take more than 500mg at any one time. Your body will not be able to use it all, so some of it could end up in the wrong place, rather than being excreted. For this reason its unwise to take 500mg tablets, unless you cut them in two, if you are taking them with calcium containing foods like milk. You correctly stated that strontium must not be take within 2 hrs of any food, to get the best absorption. Servier who make it state that its best taken at night when you go to bed. I hope I haven't confused you more Best wishes
Lynne H
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Posted 05/02/2012 21:33:26
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| Hi Lynn, Thank you very much for your reply. After reading it I think my brain had switched off, LOL. Seriously, it is all very interesting especially the Vit K. I do have Lamberts seperate Mag tablets of 150mg, maybe I am not having enough! My Calcium tablet, also Lamberts, is 150mg too. You have given me much to think about. I also take the Magnesium as its good for the heart too. I use Omega 3 and CoEnzyme Q10 too, with the occasional zinc capsule. My problem is I don't have dairy products, I have rice milk, so I eat lots of Kale and other food with Calcium. I use Dr. Mercola's Vit D Spray I find it very good, for me anyway. I expect Lulu is feeling like me at the moment having to sort it all out as to what is the best thing to do, without over doing it. I always try to keep to the dosage given on the labels to be on the safe side. I am so concerned about having OP, like everyone on here I expect, so I really do want to find what would help me. Thanks again for your help, I will let you know how I get on.
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Posted 06/02/2012 14:17:12
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| Hi Lulu, Interesting advise from Lynn and very helpful. I also suffer from M.E/Fibro/CFS with "Fibro fog" which makes concentrating rather difficult for me, at times. I will do my best! I also use a Magnesium Body Spray, mine is Ancient Minerals Mag Oil. The only thing that I don't understand is why you have to wipe it, or rinse it off after 20mins. Do you have to do that with your spray? Anyway, I hope it does its job! I am not feeling too good at the moment I have many other problems, but I will do my best to sort the Vit K out! I am thinking a having a weeks break, then restart it, I have taken it every day for a long while and I didn't realise it would build up, so that is the first thing I intend to do. I think Boron is a good mineral supplement and I believe to be very beneficial, that is just my opinion. However, I just wondered if you should be take it with SR. Have you checked that? I like to research as much as my brain will let me, before I use anything. It was just a thought. Very tired now so must go, hope you have a good day, keep smiling!
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